Some people just dont get it.....saying stuff like:"There will be SSJ5!!!"There wont be.....Why?Super Saiyan is just a form to hold more power.If it gave power,it would end up like Kaio-ken putting strss on your body since you cant hold that power.Thats why when Goku was Ultra SSJ(Ultra is 3 in the manga,well......my manga),he had to keep his power up as the form wasnt giving him power.Ill make alittle chart for you here.(Grades are rough estimates.)

SSJ>You can hold 50X your power.
SSJ Grade 2>50.25X power.
SSJ Grade 3>50.50X power.
SSJ Perfected>50.75X power.
Acended SSJ(2)>2X a SSJ can hold.
ASSJ Grade 2>100.??X power.
ASSJ Grade 3>200.??X power.
ASSJ Perfected>300.??X power.
Ultra SSJ(3)>4X a ASSJ can hold.
USSJ Grade 2>400.??X power.
USSJ Grade 3>?00.??X power.
USSJ Perfected>?00.??X power.
Oozaru SSJ(Not really a SSJ because its the hybrid of Oozaru and SSJ)>500X Base(10X50=500)
Legendary SSJ>Limitless energy.
False SSJ>Almost equivalent of a basic SSJ, as you don't get that extreme push of rage.

(Those other transformations of SSJ during the Cell Games arnt considered forms.They were forced.Merely upgrades.The only reason they looked as if in another state because they forced more power than a normal SSJ can hold.When they finally got the hang of putting more power in the form,they became "Perfect SSJs")

Why dont the forms go higher?As I see it SSJ is just to show how much power you have in you.And since SSJ4 is a true SSJ,(Being the fact it shows the true power of a Saiyan by combining thier strongest powers),there shouldnt be any reason to have anything past that.

Now,why do they become SSJ by rage if it just "Holds" power?Think about it,Saiyans get stronger when angry.ALOT stronger.(Possibily that rage gives them a permanent power boost to stay SSJ,as the only emotions Saiyans have is rage.)If you pay attention to Bardocks story,he fought Freizas army by himself and survived.Even the elites.That he couldnt do without the rage of the possibility Goku will become like Frieza,and that his friends died.When you also count Akira and Ooshis spinoff(Suggest you read it,its really cool),Bardock turns SSJ because that rage power boost made his power grow to a limit where he needs another form.This may also hint that since the Super Saiyan of Legend(Possibily Bardock)had too much power,he couldnt contain it in another form,therefore he died.

I hope you liked it,and READ it.

Wow, good job. =O

Thanks.

yeh no. you saying that goku was as strong as a ssj3 at the start of the series? didn't think so, it multiplies their power, doesnt hold it for ****.

wats dis SSJ4 you speak of?

ssj< ssj2 <ssj3
sayain < >ssj4
oozaru

that didnt work like i thought it would :(

There's absolutely nothing to prove that theory. Since it's strictly stated to multiply someone's strength, I would take that at face value, not saying that it can be used to hold more strength. Otherwise, it would almost certainly be like a health meter on a lot of video games after you level up an get a higher HP/MP stat. You still have the same value, but you can potentially hold HP if you heal yourself first and what not. Super Saiyan is a multiplier.


Super Saiyan 3 and what fans call "Ultra Super Saiyan" are two totally different things. The former is, well, Super Saiyan 3. The latter is the bulked up Super Saiyan Grade 3. Confusing? Yes. But it could always be worse. For instance, the Transformers' afterlife is called the Allspark, but there's a physical object called the AllSpark in the movies, Animated, and the Prime continuity if you're following the Exodus novel. They're not one and the same, making it very, very confusing.

[QUOTE=amtojtojboy;125375]Ill make alittle chart for you here.


These are two totally different concepts. Super Saiyan 2 and 3 shouldn't be confused with fan names for their counterparts. Fortunately, you got the multiplier right.

O
This is a common fan theory, but there's nothing official to support it. Besides, the strengths in GT are so wacky anyway, I think it goes something like this.

Base X Whatever's needed for the plot = Super Saiyan 4


And this is where I call bull. There's no indication of Broli's Legendary Super Saiyan form giving limitless energy, and it's just a fanwank that people say to make him look like the strongest character in Dragon Ball. Fact is, he isn't. Get over it.

(
Yeah, they are. They're Super Saiyan Grade 2 and Grade 3. And the Full Power Super Saiyan state is just a calm, relaxed form of Super Saiyan. They've simply gotten used to using it. It's kind of like how if someone were to sit with their foot behind their head all day, they'd eventually get used to it even if it's stressful at first. Or, you know, they could pull a muscle/tear a ligament. Whichever.


I just think there shouldn't be any higher forms because it would go further into the realms of absurdity. The straw that broke the camel's back. You know what I mean?


It's only Gohan that gets like this. There's no indication of such happening to any other characters. Rage can make you more determined, but unless you're Gohan, it's not affecting your strength any.


And where did you get that information? Freeza's grunts are probably all of lower battle powers than he is. It only makes sense that he'd come out on top.


That was rage? I must have missed it.


How the heck does it hint to that? I'm pretty sure that's just some crazy line from FUNimation's dub. Having too much power in Dragon Ball doesn't make you die. After all, Vegetto exists.


I read it, but I didn't like it.

Alright,you proved excellent points but:
-When did it say anything that it multiplies power?
-Those SSJ alternate forms arnt forms as you go beyond you normal SSJ power,but later on get used to it.
-I use those fan terms because thats what I read in the manga.SS3 was called Ultra,and SS2 was called Acended.
-Im not trying to fanwank Broly,hes strong enough already.Limitless energy comes to when you can get as much power as you can sustain.
-The other saiyans went super by rage.You forgeting all about poor Krillin?Besides,the only emotion Saiyans have is rage.Gohan has a mix of emotions that make him strong.Saiyans have only one emotion,the one that makes you stronger.
-Those grades for Super Saiyan are mostly forced.
-I have support that it lets you hold power because it makes sence.If you gain power it will be like an overkill Kaio-Ken
-Bardock facing an army is an acheivement in my opinion since,heck its 1000-1.Besides,Bardocks power was about 5000-10000 at the time.
Vegetto was strong enough to hold the power,the Super Saiyan of Legend wasnt.
Makes sence to have SS4 at 500X base.First Great ape,then Super Great ape.10X50.Then you get all that power in a smaller,more conceince body.

Think about it,Super Saiyan cant just be another Kaio-Ken.


I didnt say that.....


I dont get it?


Did you watch GT?Or are you talking like its non canon?

One of the Super Exciting Guides has multipliers for each of the Super Saiyan levels. Also, this from Daizenshuu 7:


Source


They're forms. They're classified as forms of Super Saiyan in one diagram explaining the state.


In the manga, they're called Super Saiyan 2 and 3 respectively. Are you reading some poorly done fan translations or something?


But he doesn't have limitless energy. There's nothing supporting the notion other than fanboys who think he's the strongest character ever.


It can trigger Super Saiyan, yes. But it's not necessarily making them stronger otherwise.


Depends what you mean by "forced." If you mean the state's unnatural, we can't say that for sure. If you mean they forced themselves to learn that state, then yeah, they kind of did.


There's nothing canonical to support it.


It's still likely enough to smack around some grunts. If Saiyans weren't relatively strong compared to the average soldiers, what would be the point of employing them in the first place?


There's still nothing to support the theory.


It makes sense, but it doesn't mean it's true. Like I've said, it's all just your personal theories.


It's not. It doesn't have the same effect on the body. But it increases strength in much the same way.

tl'dr, don't pass off fan theories as the truth. -.-

I have all sorts of fan theories are about things in the Dragon Ball universe... I'm just very careful to note that they're theories not facts. You essentially say that your theories are the absolute truth in your opening post.

Ok,you got me on the army part,but your source on SSJ multiplying power can also describe my theory.Also,a forced form shouldnt be considered a form.Sure SSJ is sometimes forced like Goku going SSJ3,but its just a form to hold power,or in your case,allow it to multiply.Rage makes Saiyans stronger.Its in their blood.How do you think Vegeta survived Pure Buus attacks,even the powerful ones?He was enraged.For Broly,I said limitless energy as long as you can maintain it.Well,I have to admit my manga translation is quite poor,but I think the names are quite fitting for SS2 and 3.